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Thread: Triangle (Delta) chord symbol

  1. #1

    Default Triangle (Delta) chord symbol

    Help! What does a TRIANGLE mean in a chord ? Ex :
    F triangle 7

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bernard LESIUK View Post
    Help! What does a TRIANGLE mean in a chord ? Ex :
    F triangle 7
    Means major, so in your example it is Fmaj7.
    Sometimes you read the triangle as implying the (maj) 7 and/or 9 anyway.
    EDIT: meaning F triangle ... Fmaj7
    (some might play Fmaj9)
    Last edited by dflat; 01-10-2013 at 12:23 AM. Reason: made edit

  3. #3
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    I was wondering the same thing.
    Is there a difference in playback between the two?
    A triangle with a 7 could be interpreted as a major and flat 7 at the same time??

    What made you decide to include both?

    btw link is disabled

  4. #4
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    I've always only known a triangle with a 7 to be played as a major 7th chord.

  5. #5

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    Yeah, triangle means major 7th exclusively - incidentally, how can you type that to save going to the drop-down menu?

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    I was not clear was I? I agree with you all.
    What I meant was if there is no 7 or 9, you just see F triangle for instance, then the maj 7 (perhaps maj 9) is inferred.
    I will go back and edit underneath (the link is dead so deleted it, thanks.)

    On Mac, use shift-6 - the ^ symbol.

  7. #7
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    Every time I see the triangle with a 7 I have a little pang of annoyance

    I learned about the triangle from Abersold in the 70's and when I went to Berklee I was told to never use it because it could be interoperated as a circle or dim chord.
    This was in the days before Finale so it was a real concern when most of the charts you were reading in school were hand written. Calligraphy was a requirement.

    Ma7 and Maj7 were the logical alternatives back then but I always thought the triangle was the most elegant, akin to a mathematical symbol .
    However triangle 7 (typed^7) is not at all akin to the logic behind a mathematical symbol. The 7 is meaningless and just fills up space.

    I am very curious as to when and how the 7 was added to the triangle ?
    Was it started here at iRealb?

  8. #8

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    Most users here write Δ7 to mean M7 or maj7.
    Is the "7" unneeded and redundant? Probably. I just use Δ alone when space is tight.
    Does *Δ7 imply the 9th (or 13th) ? Probably not.
    Does *Δ9 or *Δ13 imply the major 7th? Usually.
    Could using Δ without specifying additional qualities be interpreted somewhat ambiguously like the dominant 7alt ? Probably.
    Don't most jazz players modify/substitute/alter chords regardless of what's written...?
    (depends on their bandleader... and on who's paying for the work...)

    The iReal pro conventions seem to be working for and understood by most users. A common musical language is good to have.

    Music evolves. Its language has (and probably will continue to) as well.

    This (similar, more lengthy and sometimes less polite) discussion may be of interest:
    http://forum.saxontheweb.net/archive...p/t-68108.html

    We all have to put up with little pangs of annoyance from time to time.
    )BOB
    Last edited by pdxdjazz; 12-01-2014 at 05:50 PM.

  9. #9
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    Well Bob
    You make some interesting comments .

    We probably agree it all comes down to the 3rd and 7th.
    I remember this argument with David Baker back in the 70's regarding Δ9 .
    His response was basically it didn't make that big a difference. Most players would put the 9 in.
    It had no real effect on the quality or scale involved.

    However , the 6 or 69chord was used when a root was in the melody.
    So all you need is the Δ unless you want a 6 (or69) which is really a don't play the Major 7th sign.

    I guess I can see the need for the Δ9 if it was an integral part of the harmony or for the play-along feature here.

    Thanks Bob for the SOTW link , I'll get to asap
    Sax players are so anal.

    In the mean time I will continue to chastise the redundant symbol "Δ7"

    I guess my suggestion that the next iReal update includes a feature to remove all Δ7's and replace them with just Δ will fall on deaf ears

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobsax View Post
    Every time I see the triangle with a 7 I have a little pang of annoyance
    Me too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bobsax View Post
    I am very curious as to when and how the 7 was added to the triangle ?
    Was it started here at iRealb?
    ... (to answer your original question) no it was not us that started ^7 as an alternative to ^ by itself. However is has been convenient for us since we do not have room for 'maj'.

    Personally I too learnt and prefer ^ without the 7 when meaning maj7. I wonder whether after some musicians started using ^9 that then the ^ was misinterpreted as meaning maj, so the 7 was added. Another point, ^7, ^9 and ^13 in the same chart make it clear.

    We do offer both options so if you are annoyed, you can always change it (it annoys me too but I cannot be bothered changing them—sigh so I am used to it now).
    Using ^9 (or ^13) might be specific for some reason, for instance the melody being the 9th or another instrument would be playing that note (big band) so the guitarist or pianist would be given this specific chord quality so they can voice it appropriately (and it gives them more voicings to choose from).

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