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Thread: Major 7 augmented; Dominant 7 augmented

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaleMac View Post
    ...F^9#11 does come very close, but doesn't emphasize the ♭5 in the melody.
    Just so I am clear what you mean, do you mean the b5 (#11) is not at the top of the voicings all the time in the player?

  2. #12

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    It is at the top. Just the way I play crushed chords (in this case E-F-A-B) my brain hears ♭5 rather than #11 an octave higher. Probably makes no different in theory, but I never took music theory
    There's two kinds of mistakes you can play: The ones you notice, and the ones somebody else might notice.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaleMac View Post
    It is at the top. Just the way I play crushed chords (in this case E-F-A-B) my brain hears ♭5 rather than #11 an octave higher.
    Thanks, I think I understand what you are saying.
    The use of either b5 or #11 (or other pairs like 13 or 6) do not specify the octave in the voicings. You can voice say, the b5 anywhere, top, bottom, middle; the same with #11.
    You might now be wondering why the chord qualities use numbers above 8 (the octave). Extended chords are built with thirds, so we get (1, 3, 5, 7) then 9, 11, 13 (it stops after that because the notes are the same after the second octave). There should be information elsewhere if you want to follow this up sometime.

    If you have the Piano diagrams installed (you might not, because you already play well) the Library shows different voicings for each chord quality and you can see that the notes change positions with no single note on the top, no matter what the quality numbers are.

    About your comment about other instrumentalists playing with iReal Pro’s piano and its voicings, it is programmed the same, some of the voicings have the b5 (#11) at the top of the voicing (like you voice it) and other times (being reasonably random) it will have it inside the voicing. You probably know this, but the top note of any voicing tends to sound more prominent, when you play the chord’s notes at the same volume, so yes, the upper extension notes of the extended chords (like #11) will get slightly ‘lost’ if it is in the middle of a voicing (meaning other notes are sounding on top).
    But I think as an instrumentalist develops their ear (perhaps playing with a pianist or guitarist) they will be able to hear the voicings, no matter what note is on top. This is what (particularly jazz) ear training develops.

    I hope some of this is useful to you
    Last edited by dflat; 06-04-2014 at 01:38 AM. Reason: clarification of voicings and extended chords

  4. #14

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    Very useful and I'll keep this in mind for charts I intend to post in the forum. You're right, I don't have the piano diagrams, so I won't see what results from using E-/F, G7/F, F^7#11 or F^9#11. Whichever sounds best to my ear within the Player's particular programming may not always be the best choice for someone trying to study the chart. Likewise, floating a ♭ symbol in the text field isn't a great solution. (BTW, most of the sheet music I saw online has a simple F for the first chord of Never Never Land.)
    I hereby withdraw my request for ▵7♭5, with apologies to Nimbleswitch for hijacking his thread

    Footnote: I learned very early on that singers don't like it if the pianist plays the melody note when they're singing. And bass players don't like it when you play their root note. This greatly influenced how I schmush chord voicings together to stay out of everyone's way, and may give a clue why I think ♭5 rather than #11.
    There's two kinds of mistakes you can play: The ones you notice, and the ones somebody else might notice.

  5. #15
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    I like the sound of just the 3rd and 7th.

    The 3rd is really the only important one.
    The rest are like spices
    ......
    ..and we all know about too many cooks in the kitchen

  6. #16
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    Dec 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaleMac View Post
    . . . I hereby withdraw my request for ▵7♭5, with apologies to Nimbleswitch for hijacking his thread . . .
    I don't consider it hijacked at all — just developed into a very interesting thread. Thanks.
    Jack

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